If Co2 Is Causing “global Warming” And The U.s. Can’t Control China, Aren’t We Screwed Regardless?
Posted by China Sourcing CommentatorNov 12
Unless of course CO2 isn’t actually causing global warming.
I was reading this Op-Ed piece by Paul Krugman and he basically lays out the problem of cap and trade. The U.S. can cap CO2 all it wants, but if China doesn’t follow then the results will be meaningless because China’s continued increases in CO2 emissions would dwarf any cuts made by the U.S.
So what happens now??http://www.nytimes.com/2009/05/15/opinio…
China’s emissions, which come largely from its coal-burning electricity plants, doubled between 1996 and 2006. That was a much faster pace of growth than in the previous decade. And the trend seems set to continue: In January, China announced that it plans to continue its reliance on coal as its main energy source and that to feed its economic growth it will increase coal production 30 percent by 2015. That’s a decision that, all by itself, will swamp any emission reductions elsewhere.
So what is to be done about the China problem?
Nothing, say the Chinese. Each time I raised the issue during my visit, I was met with outraged declarations that it was unfair to expect China to limit its use of fossil fuels. After all, they declared, the West faced no similar constraints during its development; while China may be the world’s largest source of carbon-dioxide emissions, its per-capita emissions are still far below American levels; and anyway, the great bulk of the global warming that has already happened is due not to China but to the past carbon emissions of today’s wealthy nations.
And they’re right. It is unfair to expect China to live within constraints that we didn’t have to face when our own economy was on its way up. But that unfairness doesn’t change the fact that letting China match the West’s past profligacy would doom the Earth as we know it.
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The US is running a close second to China right now and the third worst polluter is pretty far behind so anything the US does would be beneficial. Generally speaking, possible solutions to China run the gamut from an absolute embargo (never good) to discouraging US investment and job placement in China and the purchase of Chinese goods.
The republican answer on global warming just doesn’t make any sense to me. If I understand it correctly, it is basically, “you haven’t proven the existence of global warming sufficiently enough to offset the perceived economic disadvantages of curtailing pollution.” It’s looking after the almighty dollar and I’m not sure the threshold of scientific proof they are requiring can ever be met. I think it’s already above the “beyond a reasonable doubt” standard that is used to convict people of a crime and, sometimes, sentence them to death. Why not take a more cautious approach? We know auto emissions, for example, are unnatural so why not try to curtail them.
Of course we’re screwed if we transition.
If the gov subsidizes over-priced high-tech solutions we will never cut CO2 b/c other nations will never flush their wealth down the drain in response to voodoo science.
Yeah, China is a huge problem, as is the case with most of the developing world. But that doesn’t mean we shouldn’t do anything.
co2 is a fraction of 1% of the atmosphere…water vapor in the air is
an actual major greenhouse gas…let’s see the envirowackos regulate
that!!!
Nobody can prove that pollution is good for the planet. And yes, we can’t control other countries so the planet will suffer so the rich can get richer.
Quit buying trash from China! India doesn’t either – which is the main reason manufacturerers flocked to these countries.
SO, BY YOUR LOGIC, IF WE HAVE A CHOICE BETWEEN BAD WEATHER 9 MONTHS A YEAR OR 12 MONTHS A YEAR, WE SHOULD JUST SAY SCREW IT?
Good point. Let’s do nothing. You sound like a fantastic person.
Not if we just nuke China.
haha. j/k.
Maybe we can extort money from the world to stop CO2 emissions.
global warming is a myth
This subject is very debatable and so is global warming. No one except Gore (who is getting rich from this) is agreeing that this premise is true.
Scientists are still arguing over this! Your right we cannot control China even if we wanted to.
we must suffer while China does what it wants, but we’ll feel better inside
That’s like saying that I should go around shooting people because I don’t have any control over Jim going around and shooting people. It is ridiculous.
There is a China problem, it doesn’t start from such a ridiculous proposition as questioning the scientific consensus.
Well the hope is that China and other developing nations can be convinced or coerced (probably a little of both) to limit emissions. The Chinese are not suicidal.
Global warming is not going to end civilization as we know it, but it could very well cause some of the worst famines and fresh water droughts we have ever seen. And that could, in turn, lead to one of the worst periods of war we’ve ever seen.
As the US and other first world countries are the people who purchase China’s (or anywhere) goods, it is very easy to set up a system where goods from countries not sticking to CO2 limits have a large tariff placed on their produce.
It is not fair to suggest every person should not have the same carbon limits – some countries need to greatly reduce their carbon emissions and others need to reduce the rate in which they are increasing.
I am sure most people want to live in a fair and just world, in which case every ones CO2 limits should be equal but the only way to do that is reduce ours AND for growing countries to be more careful about their production and growth.
The USA is the biggest contributor to mankind’s contribution to climate change. How are we going to stop them? Nuclear power is worse for the environment than coal. If you think coal is bad talk to the thousands of people who got cancer from Chernobyl. By the time China’s contributions to climate change (one of which is CO2) are higher than America’s, we will have woken up and realised that renewable energy is the only way forward.
AGW is a scam…but you bring up a good point.
In global markets, leveraging our domestic economy w/ cap and trade w/o other economies having to bare that burden pushes us out of the market as they can undercut our prices. Cheaper production — cheaper price to the consumer.
If we’re not careful, we’ll push American business overseas. The process started w/ outsourcing labor…further leveraging them could seal the deal.
Scary proposition for everyone else needing jobs.
Understand that’s not to say it wouldn’t be nice to clean up the environment — it just means we should do it responsibly.
Point one- If Global Warming is not a myth then China will not be living ,and neither will we, with caps, because the caps, polar variety, will melt and we will all be drowned.
Point Two- I talked to Santa, The Tooth Fairy, and The Easter Bunny and they say they have “This Global Warming” 5 decade cooling trend under control. Guess we don’t have to worry.